TPF : Don Hoffman -- Ontology

[Gnomon]

A side note, on your suggesting that we accept paradoxes. Accepting a paradox is tantamount to accepting anything. — Banno

Normally, in cases of clarity, that might seem be true. But when uncertainty is inherent, a compromise between competing opinions becomes necessary*1.That's why we call them "paradoxes"*2 (contrary opinion). If your opinion is different from mine, I could assume that you are wrong. But some differences of opinion eventually turn-out to be truish : a blend of yours & mine. And, since Psychology & Neuroscience are not yet "hard" sciences, Hoffman's "illusion" may be one of those cases. Besides, the Interface Theory is just an analogy, subject to various interpretations.

The most famous paradox in modern science is the wave/particle duality. In classical physics, a discrete particle is the opposite of a continuous wave. So the early quantum scientists debated the apparent combination of wave & particle properties. They eventually realized that the quantum scale of reality has different rules from the macro scale. Schrodinger's Cat paradox was not intended to be taken literally, but merely to illustrate the counter-intuitive nature of quantum physics. The Copenhagen Interpretation of quantum physics was intended to settle harsh differences of opinion about quantum reality. But the controversies continue to this day.

So, my interpretation of Hoffman's Interface Theory is that it is another cat-box paradox. Just as you would expect the cat to be either dead or alive, you'd expect that your senses, honed by eons of evolution, would convey accurate impressions of reality. But Hoffman's reality-in-a-box model is both/and : your mental reality and your objective reality must necessarily co-exist. Your opinion of reality may be different from mine, but that doesn't mean that you are wrong. It does suggest that mental Ideality & physical Reality coexist in the same world.

Therefore, I can accept Hoffman's special case paradox, about human perception & conception, without being forced to "accept anything", such as ghost sightings. However, like the Copenhagen consensus, the philosophical paradox may remain, even as the pragmatic science becomes more settled. At this moment, Hoffman's theory is considered to be "more evolutionary psychology than neuroscience"*3. Nevertheless, I find it useful for my non-pragmatic philosophical purposes.


*1. Quantum Uncertainty :
The quantum nature of the Universe tells us that certain quantities have an inherent uncertainty built into them, and that pairs of quantities have their uncertainties related to one another. There is no evidence for a more fundamental reality with hidden variables that underlies our observable, quantum Universe.
https://bigthink.com/starts-with-a-bang ... certainty/

*2. Paradox (against belief) :
# a situation, person, or thing that combines contradictory features or qualities.
# a seemingly absurd or self-contradictory statement or proposition that when investigated or explained may prove to be well founded or true.

*3. Interface Theory Accepted? :
Q: “Is Donald Hoffmans Interface theory of perception largely accepted? Or do most scientists think evolution has meant we perceive the world relatively accurately?”
A:It is not largely accepted, but it is also not largely rejected. It provides an interesting way to work with the world, so it sits there as most theories do, considered whenever perception is considered, but not driving how we consider it.
https://www.quora.com/Is-Donald-Hoffman ... uroscience

[Gnomon]

That's not a paradox. The equations of QM are very clear, and certainly not contradictor. You cannot use them as an example of accomodating a paradox. Shut up and calculate. — Banno

I didn't give wave-particle duality the label : "paradox". That what the scientists trying to understand the evidence of their experiments called it, when it contradicted their classical expectations. Einstein & co. tried to contradict their contradiction (the Copenhagen compromise or accomodation to uncertainty) with the EPR paradox*1*2. This was a difference of opinion among experts : literally a para-dox*3. Is Zeno's paradox really a paradox, or simply the result of inappropriate framing of a question?*4

Schrodinger's equation is clear : the physical status of subatomic particles depends on how you look at it. So different observers and different setups (frames) reach different conclusions. And a difference of opinion (belief) is a paradox. As far as the scientists can tell, there is no Fact of the matter. A particle in superposition is neither a localized object nor a continuous wave, so they punted*5 and called it a "wavicle". Which is a contradiction of Newtonian physics. So, I stand by my use of quantum physics as an example of scientists forced to "accomodate" to a paradox, in order to leave them free to "shut up and calculate". Now, what was the question?


*1. The Einstein–Podolsky–Rosen (EPR) paradox is a thought experiment proposed by physicists Albert Einstein, Boris Podolsky and Nathan Rosen which argues that the description of physical reality provided by quantum mechanics is incomplete
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein% ... en_paradox

*2. Copenhagen accomodation :
Quantum realism rejects both physical realism and Bohr’s Copenhagen compromise.
https://brianwhitworth.com/quantum-real ... ompromise/
Note --- words related to accommodation, such as: compromise, reconciliation, adaptation, compliance, composition ...

*3. Paradox etymology :
mid 16th century (originally denoting a statement contrary to accepted opinion): via late Latin from Greek paradoxon ‘contrary (opinion)’, neuter adjective used as a noun, from para- ‘distinct from’ + doxa ‘opinion’.

*4. Framing contradictory evidence :
So the crucial question becomes: How can something be both a wave - spread-out over space with a succession of humps and troughs, and at the same time, not spread out - a tiny, localised point-like particle? This dilemma is known as the wave-particle paradox.
https://www.open.edu/openlearn/science- ... -particles

*5. Punted: To Give Up
But as an idiom, “to punt” means to give up, to defer action, or to pass responsibility off to someone else.

[Gnomon]

Telling an Australian how to punt?

In the post in which this discussion started, you claimed that one could accept idealism and realism simultaneously, that this was an acceptable paradox, analogous to other supposed paradoxes. — Banno

Sorry if I was bringing "coals to Newcastle". I wasn't sure that the American football idiom would have the same meaning for those who are not allowed to touch the ball with their hands.

Apparently, my idiomatic use of the terms "Idealism" and "Realism" also did not translate for you. To some absolutist thinkers, they are like oil & water, which don't mix. But in the Enformationism thesis, aethereal Ideas & Real stuff grow from the same root : Generic Information. I don't expect you to blithely accept my idiosyncratic Holistic (multi-value) BothAnd*1 worldview. FWIW, it is a modern alternative to the ancient classical Either/Or (two value) compartmentation, which ignores complexity and divides the world into convenient categories and stark oppositions. Either/Or is an idealized worldview.

Instead, the 21st century BothAnd Principle derives from the 20th century Quantum Uncertainty Principle*2, which acknowledges a "fundamental limit" to human knowledge. BothAnd also accepts such counter-intuitive "facts" as Wave/Particle duality, for which you can't draw a hard line between those classical definitions. In my worldview, mental Ideas exist within the same Reality as material objects, not in some heavenly realm. So the line between Ideal & Real is arbitrary. It's all one universal system, stemming from a single source. Therefore, the exclusive Paradox exists in your mind, not in the world.


*1. The BothAnd principle is one of Balance, Symmetry and Proportion. It eschews the absolutist categories of Idealism vs Realism, in favor of the relative compromises of Pragmatism. It espouses the Practical Wisdom of the Greek philosophers, instead of the Perfect Wisdom of the Hebrew Priests. The BA principle of pragmatism requires “skin in the game” to provide real-world feedback, which counter-balances the extremism of Idealism & Realism. That feedback establishes limits to freedom and boundaries to risk-taking. BA is a principle of Character & Virtue, viewed as Phronesis or Pragmatism, instead of Piety or Perfectionism.

*2. Uncertainty Principle :
In quantum mechanics, the uncertainty principle is any of a variety of mathematical inequalities asserting a fundamental limit to the accuracy with which the values for certain pairs of physical quantities of a particle, such as position, x, and momentum, p, can be predicted from initial conditions. ___Wikipedia