Phil Forum : Probability of God

[Gnomon]

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussi ... ent/473009

16. But, if we are to gamble and wonder whether our universe formed without a God as a primary cause, versus a God as a primary cause, it is infinite to 1 that our universe was formed by a God instead of simply forming on its own. — Philosophim

Since it declined into name-calling at the end, I resurrect this thread with trepidation, simply to add my two-cents-worth on the question of gambling odds for God. Apparently, you are placing your bet, based on your calculation of "infinite to one" odds in favor of a Prime Cause. I previously linked to an article reviewing the book by Steven Unwin -- The Probability of God : A Simple Calculation That Proves the Ultimate Truth. The author calculated somewhat more modest 67% odds that our world was created by The Christian God. I must congratulate him on a good try, presented with reason and humor. FWIW, here's my review of the book, posted some time after this faded into infinity. Enjoy!

The Probability of God : The Hard Question of Divine Existence
http://bothandblog6.enformationism.info/page60.html

The "Fun Puzzle" continues . . . . for those of us who can discuss "god questions" with a sense of humor and fair play.

PS___I never did find your "flaw"

[Gnomon]

Consider the theist who takes it to be an obvious given that the Bible is the word of God. — Hippyhead

I don't accept the Bible as the "word of God". That's why I was interested in an argument that uses Mathematics, instead of Scripture, as evidence for belief in God. It didn't convince me. But it might work for those who accept the authority of both Scripture and Mathematics.

[Gnomon]

It seems to me that given the nature of what Christians and other monotheists call 'God' there just can't be a way to prove or disprove his, her or their existence - or otherwise. — Horace

The author of the referenced book seems to agree with you. The existence of anything invisible & intangible must be inferred from circumstantial evidence : Dark Matter, for example. That's why some religious believers reluctantly admit that Faith comes down to an act of will, or of personal experience, not logical or mathematical reasoning.

The Probability of God : "he admits that, according to Catholic doctrine, “it is the human faculty of will, and not reason, that plays the crucial role in achieving faith”. Moreover, “this position is fully consistent with . . . the notion that faith ultimately rests on an accumulation of probabilities”.
http://bothandblog6.enformationism.info/page64.html

[Gnomon]

Either way, that still begs my main question, whether effort by philosophers to prove or disprove the existing of god or gods is and endless quest with not hope of a generally agreed proof? — Horace

Yes. But then, the "God" question is the ultimate philosophical game. Science asks relatively soft "how" questions that are amenable to hard evidence. But the hard questions are always, not "what" or "how, but the childish "why, why, why." Questions about verifiable facts can be proven to the satisfaction of reasonable people. But questions about "Meaning" are always subjective, and debatable.

That the physical world, "in which we live and move and have our being", exists is (almost) beyond question. But why? That my thinking mind exists, is (almost) un-doubtable. But why? Most animals seem to take existence for granted, so death comes as a surprise, except for humans. But why? So, asking "why" questions seems to come with the human genome.

Yet, after several thousand years of philosophizing, these questions remain unanswered, except for those who take the easy-out of Faith. Yet, what else will human questers find to do with their free time? The search for subjective Meaning is an open-ended non-linear multi-player game. Your move.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonlinear_gameplay

[Gnomon]

So it really is simply a game or pastime. . . . That still leaves me wondering whether (and if so why) it's a priority for my taxes to be spent on professional philosophers and pilosophy teachers continuing to debate the existence or otherwise of a god or gods? This certainly is, as you say, debatable. — Horace

Philosophy is indeed a mind-game or personal pastime. And some scientists call philosophers "feckless", because their introverted activities typically make no physical difference in the material world. But philosophical investigations are intended to get us "closer to Truth" about the world --- to change minds, not to change material reality. Philosophy refines Beliefs about the world, and those Beliefs and Intentions have Political and Physical consequences in the world. That's why the philosophical game goes on long after the ninth inning.


“The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it." ___Karl Marx.
Note -- Changing the world is the job of Politics, not Philosophy.

Aboutness : In philosophy, intentionality is the power of minds and mental states to be about, to represent, or to stand for, things, properties and states of affairs.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/intentionality/

Closer To Truth : presents the world’s greatest thinkers exploring humanity’s deepest questions. Discover fundamental issues of existence. Engage new and diverse ways of thinking. Appreciate intense debates. Share your own opinions. Seek your own answers.
https://www.closertotruth.com/about/overview